Remove (Merge) TAC Departments - Denied

[utetwo]

Ultimately, it's about the betterment of the server, rather than yourselves. 

[Alton]

Omg guys, stop with the 500+ word responces please

[Yeep]

17 hours ago, springs.exe said:

+support 

But keep DS

 

+Support 

but keep SWAT

[th3]

5 hours ago, Freeze said:

 

- Support

I see where the frustation comes from, and I share them. But I think it would cause more issues then its needed to be.

Look when SRT was merged into SWAT, the amount of bullshit that brought for 1 department  was insane. Let alone when we do it with 2 or 3. Everything any department heads have worked on for the last years, down the drain.

And yes I do believe that there are to many tac units but I dont know whether merging them is the best option.

And the problem with this post is that you only make a statement.

Huge important stuff like this needs to be planned months ahead and this post only names problems and not solutions or n actual steady plan. 

And the same for every + Support people make. Everybody finally gets their opinions out of them and put them here but dont think it through. Only stating concerns and not n actual plan of how it should work.

- Freeze

The whole idea of a suggestion is to spark a discussion. It isn’t planned out over several months. Obviously people put their opinions here, the whole idea is list concerns and flesh out all the positives and negatives that such a suggestion would have. I don’t like that you are implying that we don’t have an actual plan because you don’t either and it’s rude. In fact the statement you made is hypocritical as you put your opinion just like every other +Support did. It’s your opinion that this isn’t a suggestion with a “steady” plan or that it doesn’t include solutions. The suggestion is about an issue with too many tactical departments, and it’s suggesting that roleplay would be better with a smaller amount of them on the server. I don’t know where you were trying to go with that but it just doesn’t change my opinion that some commanders won’t view this suggestion in an unbiased and would rather keep their ranks while it hurts the server.

[𝙁𝙧𝙚𝙚𝙯𝙚]

52 minutes ago, th3 said:

The whole idea of a suggestion is to spark a discussion. It isn’t planned out over several months. Obviously people put their opinions here, the whole idea is list concerns and flesh out all the positives and negatives that such a suggestion would have. I don’t like that you are implying that we don’t have an actual plan because you don’t either and it’s rude. In fact the statement you made is hypocritical as you put your opinion just like every other +Support did. It’s your opinion that this isn’t a suggestion with a “steady” plan or that it doesn’t include solutions. The suggestion is about an issue with too many tactical departments, and it’s suggesting that roleplay would be better with a smaller amount of them on the server. I don’t know where you were trying to go with that but it just doesn’t change my opinion that some commanders won’t view this suggestion in an unbiased and would rather keep their ranks while it hurts the server.

Im not saying people cant discuss a topic, Im fine with people stating there concerns and problems, Im all for it. The only thing im saying is that there is alot more behind the words : "remove a department or merge departments". And that some of the factors behind it also needs to be looked at. And im not bias, not at all but I am allowed to look out for my department and everyone's elses.

If my previous post didnt come across like that I apologize for that.

[utetwo]

22 minutes ago, Freeze said:

Im not saying people cant discuss a topic, Im fine with people stating there concerns and problems, Im all for it. The only thing im saying is that there is alot more behind the words : "remove a department or merge departments". And that some of the factors behind it also needs to be looked at. And im not bias, not at all but I am allowed to look out for my department and everyone's elses.

If my previous post didnt come across like that I apologize for that.

This post was not intended to be a statement, I have merely been experiencing issues with the bloated amount of TAC departments in PoliceRP.

 

Sometimes you have to tear things up in order to progress.

[thebigr]

Huge -Support 

We tried this already with SWAT and SRT, they forced you to be a SSGT+ in swat to even join SRT and it was a huge mess because people were kicked out for "not being the proper rank required to join the department". No-one liked it and the department became inactive. So, no this would be a horrible thing and on top of that who's to say that people want to merge the Tac teams. You're gonna be forcing people to re-work their training and ranks into merging tac teams which would basically be trying to fix something that isn't broke. I don't see any up side to this, with forcing this down peoples throats. in turn the major problems with this is we have different ranks (SRT has the USMC Ranks), every tac has their own unique thing and training, and you're forcing people in departments they don't necessarily want to be in. Another thing is you realize that everyone has different training right, we also have different specialties such as the obvious SRT has Parkour SWEP, or how about the command structures how is that gonna work you have an OK idea but there are just to many factors to be put into play such as oh shoot we have 5 commands and Co-commanders what are we gonna do divide 5 Tac Teams into groups of 2? How are the ranking systems gonna work? How long will the roster be? how hard will it be to get into the new Tac team once its created?  How long will it take to merge the SOP'? There are so many unanswered questions to be solved. Also, you say everyone would be able to keep their rank, that's incorrect I can't find 1 Tac unit besides SRT that uses USMC Ranks so if you would like to tell me what Gunnery Sargent and Master-Gunnery Sargent would transfer to please enlighten me until then lets leave the Tac units be. If people want to join a different Tac team let them do it themselves don't force them to do it.

             Overall, you have an OK Idea that would work on paper but once put into reality and into the server its gonna be a shit show. so you're getting a -Support from me

 

 

Edited February 1, 2020 by thebigr

[Dang]

On 1/31/2020 at 10:52 PM, springs.exe said:

+support 

But keep DS

 

 

[Hunt]

On 2/1/2020 at 1:21 AM, Yobo said:

- Support

 

Everyone will keep their ranks?

So we are going to have 6 Commanders and 6 Co Commanders? Abandon their unit and join another where they wont have the same abilities?
That poured their literal heart and soul to get the department too where it is right now?


If this going to be your argument of actual being a role play server Rockford State Police is a version of Illinois State Police.. and Rockford is in Illinois. State Police have a Tac Team..
State Police has their tactical department for valid reasons.. It is a department of State providing tactical need too Outskirts and anywhere else needed. They are Elite trained State troopers. 

We would be a Role-play unit if people like yourself wouldn't drive away and break priority rules then problems regarding no role play wouldn't occur. 

I understand your point in this but you need too understand how much effort we have put into these departments behind the scenes, How much effort SMT have put into it. How much hours of training and SOP writing just to be merged and then have arguments of how we are doing things. I strongly disagree. 

State has their way of doing things and has a close family bond.
Same as the other departments. 

So when we rock up too situations we all deal with it how we know. And it works. I don't see what the argument is? We barely have Alot of TAC on most the time. And when we do its because of Mass Crime. 
And before YOU say that "oh goverment are so overpowerd with all the tac teams we cant kill them" I can give you hours upon hours of videos that show me and two others getting rekd by a Negev... 

What benefit will this have?

I beleive this descion should come from High Command Circle like we have been discusing in our High Command chat. After all. You wouldnt understand what Blitzon, Mikey, Livebait, Andrew, Eternity, Hunt, Freeze, Ronin, Ecott, Calamity and Myself have gone through too get our department where they are today..

Yeah this is kinda dumb it’s like saying hey let’s remove all the ccs that will add some rp! No it won’t just becouse people ain’t swat doesn’t mean there gunna be realy good at rp

[Burboon boi]

+support

I feel our server has become a COD server and not a roleplay server. Half the time when i get on its no longer rp situations most of the time its a robbery or its someone shooting cops. When there is little to no enforcement of priority rules we need to make a choice really. Do we want to start enforcing those rules or do we want to merg departments and see if that benefits us. It's just hard to get on sometimes when I cant even drive 50 feet before im getting shot at.

[LuckyGoose]

+support 

Think about it, other units suffer from all these units. I get a lot of people who would be upset as they don't want to lose commander, but other departments are suffering from all the other units taking over. I do think we need just 2 tac units like SWAT, and CERT one for PD and another for State. 

[[GL] Mikey]

no, reasons above/not needed 

 

Edited February 7, 2020 by [GL] Mikey

[th3]

12 hours ago, Toxic_Wolf10 said:

Who are you to talk like that. You probably should cool down. 

If I was able to report posts on the forums then I would report your post. It does not contribute anything and distracts from the topic at hand. If you have an issue with his post then report it especially when you aren’t contributing to this at all except to project your view on his post which I might add was already resolved. A better way to do this would have been to pm him because and I’ll be honest, his post was perfectly reasonably and was not inciting an argument or anything provocative. You just look like a dick with that post I quoted.

On a side note I really appreciate a JMT member commenting on a suggestion. Too bad he just limits his responses to 1 word

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by th3

[Will]

+/- Support

+ More/ better RP
+ Less tac teams with different command and such 

- Will cause mass panic and cause among users within a tac dept

[utetwo]

Everybody, please keep this a civil discussion. Personal attacks are not warranted for this type of debate!

 

[TheJayden]

It's a good idea but there are special things about each tactical department. They added them for a reason

-Support

[JUDOPENGUIN]

- support i was around when srt was part of swat and cert got removed (SRT was stand alone and took in CERT members while this happend)  then added back in it was in one word chaos 

Edited February 7, 2020 by JUDOPENGUIN

[Inactive]

Massive + Support

There's some thought that needs to happen, but there's so many reasons to try to change things. We have 5 tactical departments (plus CAT) and the server just doesn't have enough players for that many. There's intense competition between them and several departments get left starved of members with serious inactivity. To add to this we have 3 departments that are supposed to be "The elite of the elite" with stupidly high armor and op guns. So who really is the elite of the elite then? The competition to get that reputation has caused extremely op and unbalanced tac teams which makes criminals have no chance they try to be better than each other. Yes there's slight differences between each branch, but they aren't very big. CERT, and ARU are the only truely unique departments. CERT is the subdepartment branch that makes state far more enjoyable and is an all around  type of department. They have decent armor and guns, and nice cars, but nothing is way too op. ARU is a PD sub-department, (which means it uses pd ranks instead of its own). The guns and armor are good only if you are wise in how you use them. It's a skill based department in combat, and a pursuit oriented department  overall. Swat seems like it is under powered. It hasn't had an overhaul in a long time and it doesn't have the guns or armor to compete with any other department. On the other hand SRT and DS however seem to only exist to be op. They have stupid amounts of armor, way too powerful guns, literally every op car. It's way too much. They take all the members and leave the other departments are hurting bad because of it. Another point I'll  make is they all are the same in how roles work. Ever notice every single tac department has the same roles? Marksmen, medic, riflemen/sharpshooter, Breacher, (and K9 for ARU). I don't necessarily think we have to merge or even remove departments to fix the problem. What we need to do is diversify the departments. Another thing we need to do is nerf the Negev. That in my opinion is the real underlying cause for the tac teams being like they  are. If it was reasonably balanced then we wouldn't have the need for tactical departments with nearly 300 armor. I propose that the Negev has the fire rate slightly reduced and the damage halved. That is what will bring back the role play.

 

Overall I believe we need to greatly change the departments. Each one should be entirely unique with different roles. Each department should be oriented towards one activity (EX: ARU being a pursuit oriented department). If each one has more than a slightly different rank system separating it from the others a lot of the issue will be solved

Edited February 14, 2020 by Ryan The Epic Guy

[Quangasaurusrex]

+support

 

Being a previous supervisor in CERT, the whole "We have a plan to enter the bank/raid and save whoever" is a load of lies. Everytime tac says "tactical units are tactical because we train and have plans and yadda yadda" are just for show. Yeah sure we have training and whatnot and stack units, but once someone gets shot its a free for all. The formations break and people just run everywhere. Most of the time tac units just run in and gun the guy down.

 

Not only that, CP are suppose to aid each other, it's usually just yelling on who has priority over the given situation and its mostly CP just fighting over each other. More tac units just cause more hassle and we all have the same abilities.

If we're going to go on a "Realism" scale, SWAT IRL are allowed to pull people over. SWAT is what the name implies, Specialized weaponry and tactics. It's just PD with extra training and weaponry. Obviously if we're going to go into "but it's semi serious it doesn't matter" than that defeats the whole purpose of realism.

Not to mention that CERT is just a buffed PD that is allowed to run into raids and stuff since they can pull people over anyways and have way more running speed and weaponry and armor.

 

I'm not trying to diss on CERT or any tac units, but if we are going to be serious about it, there are so many Tac units it's just getting ridiculous. How are we gonna get rid of them is not my problem, but the fact remains is that we have so many tac that it's just getting out of hand since they all have the same goal and responsibilities. 

[Noah REmiX]

KNOW WHAT I have an idea!

HELL NO -Support

look here’s a simple solution

we all keep our departments and ranks

BUT don’t add another tac unit.

This next thing is just a opinion

The only department I don’t understand is ARU it is litterly PD but able to run into raids and shit

its also British I thought this was a American server! Just saying that’s the only department I have a problem with. Not saying remove it like just saying. That I have no problem with any except for ARU.

[RicoTheGoat]

On 1/31/2020 at 8:37 PM, Jayden said:

I honestly agree. There are far too many. But then again Yobo makes a great point. The leaders of their departments have put a lot into making their department what they are, and to lose that would be insane to them. Not only that but imagine being SMT and having to choose which department gets removed. There honestly won't be a way to make a fair decision.

 

While it sounds like I should be +/- supporting , I will +support based on the fact that I'm sure merging could work somehow, and that when it comes down to it, it is a video game. I don't think anyone should complain about it. All in all would be a betterment to the server so.

+Support

(There is no way in hell this suggestion gets Accepted tho xD

 

On 2/1/2020 at 5:54 AM, Freeze said:

 

- Support

I see where the frustation comes from, and I share them. But I think it would cause more issues then its needed to be.

Look when SRT was merged into SWAT, the amount of bullshit that brought for 1 department  was insane. Let alone when we do it with 2 or 3. Everything any department heads have worked on for the last years, down the drain.

And yes I do believe that there are to many tac units but I dont know whether merging them is the best option.

And the problem with this post is that you only make a statement.

Huge important stuff like this needs to be planned months ahead and this post only names problems and not solutions or n actual steady plan. 

And the same for every + Support people make. Everybody finally gets their opinions out of them and put them here but dont think it through. Only stating concerns and not n actual plan of how it should work.

- Freeze

 

[[GL] Elapin]

-/+ Support

We have too many or a lot of departments and half of them are tactical units. 

Maby you can make like DS a higher version of SWAT/SWAT SPC-CPL+ to Apply and SRT a higher level of CERT or they could be there own

----This is just my opinion but maby remove ARU because we are kinda in an american city and having a UK tac unit is a bit wierd---

--------------------------------------------------------

makes server more intteresting with amount of tac departments

get more people to join the departments

HRT Sub Department?? CAT Full Tac??

 

Edited February 18, 2020 by [GL] Elapin

[Echo]

On 2/3/2020 at 3:56 AM, Jesse said:

Yeah this is kinda dumb it’s like saying hey let’s remove all the ccs that will add some rp! No it won’t just becouse people ain’t swat doesn’t mean there gunna be realy good at rp

- Support

[th3]

On 2/3/2020 at 5:56 AM, Hunt said:

Yeah this is kinda dumb it’s like saying hey let’s remove all the ccs that will add some rp! No it won’t just becouse people ain’t swat doesn’t mean there gunna be realy good at rp

CC's aren't Tactical units and can't become Tac units. Not really sure what you are trying to say with that analogy.

[Rick Sanchez]

- Support

- It's not like every tac unit is massively active. There's rarely more than 5 online. The variety just gives people a choice. The only issue I have is that they're too similar, Only player models really make them unique.

On 2/10/2020 at 11:43 PM, Quangasaurusrex said:

Being a previous supervisor in CERT, the whole "We have a plan to enter the bank/raid and save whoever" is a load of lies. Everytime tac says "tactical units are tactical because we train and have plans and yadda yadda" are just for show. Yeah sure we have training and whatnot and stack units, but once someone gets shot its a free for all. The formations break and people just run everywhere. Most of the time tac units just run in and gun the guy down.

I couldn't disagree with you more. I have never experienced any arguing about who has priority, its normally just the highest command online and responding, And I'm not sure why you think tactics is a load of lies. CERT follows their CO's orders and we do what they taught us in training. and I've seen other Tac units do this too.

On 2/15/2020 at 2:55 PM, Noah REmiX said:

The only department I don’t understand is ARU it is litterly PD but able to run into raids and shit

its also British I thought this was a American server! Just saying that’s the only department I have a problem with. Not saying remove it like just saying. That I have no problem with any except for ARU.

Yes, ARU is British but they are hardly just PD. They just the same training as any other TAC. I don't see why you only have an issue with them when CERT doesn't actually exist as a TAC unit and DS is military. You don't have to make sense of why they exist. They're there and they're fun and give the server more variety on TAC teams.