I have a question that could not be answered in game.

[ViperKimg]

Below is a situation that occurred in-game, but could not be handled by staff. Due to lack of evidence, I have placed it here rather than in the report forums.

So, SX had 2 bases built beside each other, we were grinding in one (with bitminers only) and doing a money silo in the other (Every member was currently in the money silo base protecting it). The CERT that was raiding the money silo base ran away from it and began a false raid on the other base because they said they got shot from that base, but it was empty, so that was impossible. I decided not to alert staff of the false raid as all that was happening was the CERT were wasting their time raiding a base with only bitminers in it and no people. They then took a vantage point on that base a began shooting at us from said vantage point.  https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1940730839

I talked to both Freeze and MiKeY about this and neither of them could give me a definite answer as to whether or not that would be Fail RP.

Here are the facts: The motd states: "You cannot take over places. If you raid a place, you must leave after you have accomplished your goal. Do NOT stay to prevent people from returning for an extended period of time." The main argument that CERT Commander Maddog used was the fact that the rule was focused towards criminal, and did not apply to government, but if this was true, the rule would be under the "Criminal" section rather than right there at the top under "Basics," so the fact that they don't have to follow the rule boggles me.

He then made the argument that in real life, government would just get in the other base and use it as a vantage point, but around a month ago I was warned for FailRP for leaving a general store raid after gas was thrown in. I was simply trying to value my life and thought that leaving the general store robbery was a better alternative to sitting in the gas and just waiting to die, but I was still warned because either way, I still broke a rule. So my argument here is that in real life, sure, maybe government would've raided my base for no reason, sure, maybe they would've noticed the clear advantage of shooting at the money silo base from the bitmining base, but these CERT still broke a rule, therefore, I feel there should be a punishment. 

Despite all of this, the screenshot posted above was the only proof we managed to capture of the situation because none of us were recording at the time and the staff sit lasted longer than 20 minutes, so trying to make an NVIDIA clip or whatever was out of the question. Therefore, I feel a report against the offending players is unnecessary due to the fact that it will just be denied due to a lack of evidence. All Maddog would have to do is say "no we didn't" and it would be over. Because of this, Freeze suggested that I simply make a discussion post rather than a report.

I really just want this question answered and am open to different opinions, but I just feel it is unfair for me to get a warn for valuing my life while these CERT members get off without even a verbal.

 

Edit: I would also like to mention that the way this sit ended was the staff member that was handling the sit went into the CERT room in teamspeak to speak to all of them and then pretty much just came back and said "sorry but I can't warn them, I'm just gonna close the sit now." So I have no clue what happened in that TeamSpeak call but I also feel that was a very unfair and unprofessional part of the staff sit.

Edited December 20, 2019 by ViperKimg

[Revan]

See this is tricky as I was there. The weird thing was that there was a report of shots coming from behind which is the direction of said secondary base. Their goal in theory could be to eliminate threat and use base as a vantage point into yours. As far as preventing people from returning they knew all of you at that point whoever was left had to be in the base you were residing in. Thus you can’t return to a base when you are already at another. I don’t know this is weird as they were so close and we would’ve had that area blocked off regardless whether that base existed or not. I totally see where you are coming from but this is just one of those freak incidents that will rarely repeat itself. So I don’t think CERT should be punished just merely space out your bases next time.

And as far as being gassed at gen store I would agree with you that you shouldn’t be warned for wanting to get out of the gas.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Revan

[ViperKimg]

14 minutes ago, Revan said:

See this is tricky as I was there. The weird thing was that there was a report of shots coming from behind which is the direction of said secondary base. Their goal in theory could be to eliminate threat and use base as a vantage point into yours. As far as preventing people from returning they knew all of you at that point whoever was left had to be in the base you were residing in. Thus you can’t return to a base when you are already at another. I don’t know this is weird as they were so close and we would’ve had that area blocked off regardless whether that base existed or not. I totally see where you are coming from but this is just one of those freak incidents that will rarely repeat itself. So I don’t think CERT should be punished just merely space out your bases next time.

And as far as being gassed at gen store I would agree with you that you shouldn’t be warned for wanting to get out of the gas.

I also believe I shouldn't have been warned for that, but I posted a warn appeal and it got instantly denied, then waited a few days and posted a suggestion to add a rule change where you could value your life and flee if they gassed the gen stores and it was also instantly denied. 

Given this, I just assumed that the motd is permanent and any slight bend of the rules would get you warned, so I feel a warn should have been given out, but like I said, the staff sit ended with a TeamSpeak chat that I wasn't allowed to take part in sooo....

[Aaron Faustin]

This seems strange, Sounds to me like we need a rule added / edited to clarify this, I'm not sure about irl but certainly in game it doesn't seem fair to just take over another persons base to use it against another base your raiding. From the looks of it they raided your other base which ic they do NOT know is yours because they heard shots coming from it, So that part is fair. However once they recognize there is no threat in there and especially no illegal activity of any kind, They should then leave and proceed back to the situation at your Money Silos. That IS what the rule states and it doesn't state that the rule is only for criminal infact it isn't in the criminal section.

 

With you getting warned i happen to agree with your point of view, There should really always be an opportunity for you to value your life so i would agree with a rule being added to do such, The only thing i'd have to need put in that rule is i'd say is if you come out you MUST be completely surrendering and MUST comply with orders, Therefore they cant just come out just to escape or make it easier to kill Gov.

 

Overall: I feel like SMT should discuss this and figure out how they really want the rules to be and then alter the rules if necessary and reply to this post with a response of how this situation should play out.